Are we all Lakered-out? Probably not. As I may have mentioned somewhere else, I realized 6-7 years ago that there is no such thing as “too much Lakers news.”

Anyway, the other day, I got into an off-the-blog discussion with a former colleague, Damian Secore, about where the team should go next. Think of it as overhearing two Lakers observers talking about the team.

It’s mostly about what needs to happen next. And Lamar Odom comes up a lot. In fact, it started on the blog entry entitled, “Lakers Future: Should They Trade Lamar?”

The text in italic is me.

Comment:

As some know, I have been calling for an Odom deal for a couple years. As I said in an earlier take on this blog, you can’t win with guys like Odom when they are supposed to be a significant contributor to your team. Why couldn’t the Wizards have taken Odom instead of Caron Butler a few years back? Always loved Caron Butler.

The thing is the Lakers are already paying mega salaries to Kobe and Gasol and will do so with Bynum in a year or two, to go along with hefty, overpriced salaries they are carrying with Vlad Rad and Walton. Vujacic and Turiaf now need to be re-signed and there’s more money taken away from the kitty of J Buss, who has complained about being over the salary cap numerous times in the past. No way they’ll be able to afford to re-sign Odom after next season.

The latest example of Odom’s lack of hoops IQ, defense and focus/heart was last night.

In an elimination game, he doesn’t score a basket until the 4th quarter, he guards KG much of the night as KG has his best game of the series, he doesn’t take charges several times when the opportunity was there, and he makes 1 out of 2 countless times at the free throw line.

In my estimation, the 3 Lakers that need to go are Odom, Walton and Vlad Rad. 3 soft guys who happen to be the Lakers’ 3 most overpaid guys and 3 worst defenders. Why did the Lakers lose this series? Because their defense could not get stops down the stretch and because it could not protect leads and thwart major Boston runs, especially last night.

Odom is attractive as a trade commodity. His stock has risen since the Gasol trade as he was really good in the last couple months of the regular season and in the first couple rounds of the playoffs. His expiring contract after next year is what teams who are looking to slash payroll are looking for.

Of course, Odom will have to be dealt to an Eastern Conference team which is not a championship contender because, when dealing a guy who carries such a hefty salary and is recognized as a good player in this league, you’re going to have to get a good player in return. No one in the West and no contender in the East wants to make the Lakers, with their current roster, better right about now. I don’t know what good players are available at about Odom’s salary level but I am thinking maybe it would not be out of the realm of possibility to trade him back to Miami (Riles really liked Odom) for Shawn Marion (a guy who can opt out of his contract who brings defense, athleticism, rebounding and you don’t have to run plays for him and he gets his points) or a Jason Richardson (tough-minded guy who plays with heart, plays defense and has a three-point stroke to spread the floor and stretch defenses) from Charlotte.

Now, do I think Odom will be dealt? Nope. The Lakers (Mitch) will probably be of the opinion that the core and young roster is set, that it reached the finals this year unexpectedly, that things may have been different had Bynum played, and that they all learned a valuable lesson of how to win it all through this past series with Boston. All valid points.

However, in Odom’s case, he’s been making the same mistakes and has the same flaws in his game as he had when he was in college with Rhode Island. His full potential will never be tapped and his game has leveled out. It’s not like he’s only been in the league a few years either. There is no hope for improvement. He is now what he will be in the future. I only hope Kobe/Bynum/Gasol/young bench players can overcome what Odom does to set the Lakers back.

As Lakers fans, we should not be angry, but just exercise a little patience. Boston was the better team and was a bad matchup for the Lakers from a personnel standpoint. The Lakers went from first-round losers to NBA Finalists, surpassing everyone’s expectations by at least a couple playoff rounds. Kobe is staying put for the duration of his career and the Lakers will be much better with the return of Bynum and the continued development of what is the 2nd youngest team in the NBA as it stands now. Bynum may have been the difference in the Finals. I’d like to find out whether this is true next year.

Subject: Re: [Paul Oberjuerge] Comment: “Lakers Future: Should They Trade Lamar?”

Another nice take.

I’d like Shawn Marion, but Riles seemed to like him … and he was a bit of a malcontent in Phoenix, no?

I think the Lakers have a decent chance of moving Lamar — if they wanted to — because of the whole “expiring contract” thing.
On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:27 AM …wrote:
Marion’s deal in Phoenix is that he was an immature sulker who wanted more attention and more credit for Phoenix’s success and was a little jealous that Nash and Amare got most of the attention. I read this in a Jack McCallum book where he spent a year with the Suns (2005-06 season, I think). That and Marion sometimes did not play to his regular season level in the playoffs. I know this sounds a lot like Odom in may ways, but I thought Marion would be a better fit for what the Lakers need and was thinking that perhaps Phil could get him to grow up a little. Especially since Kobe will always be the star in LA as long as he is playing, and I think Marion could accept that.

As far as J-Rich, I know he’s only been in Charlotte one season and had a good year and who knows if they’d even be willing to part with him. I was just trying to come up with guys I could possibly see moving off the top of my head in a couple mins. so that I could continue with my take.

Subject: Re: [Paul Oberjuerge] Comment: “Lakers Future: Should They Trade Lamar?

“I’m not sure I could stand looking at Shawn Marion’s butt-ugly shot for more than a couple of games per season. I like his athleticism, and he plays defense, but that shot!

Interesting, that I’m not the only guy thinking of moving Lamar. LAT’s day-after Lakers coverage seemed to focus on him, and the possibility of a trade.

The wild card here is … is Bynum really that good? Do they KNOW? He had, what, two good months? And he’s had knee issues in the past, too. Now he hasn’t really exercised in six months. I wonder if he’s ever gonna be an 82-game kinda guy.

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 12:07 PM, wrote:

I’d be happy with Marion. They don’t need any more 18 ppg scorers on offense with Kobe, Pau and Bynum, plus the young bench guys coming along. He’ll still get 15-16 ppg, but we need that defense, rebounding, energy and athleticism more than anything on offense.

I think Bynum will be among the top 3 centers in the NBA (with Yao and D. Howard, if you want to call him a C and not a PF) within 2 years. He averaged 13 ppg, 11 reb and 2 blks (he altered many more shots) as a 20-year-old. That’s awesome. I realize he was set up for many of his baskets, but he is a great offensive touch and nice form on his jump hook. You can see Kareem has had an impact on him and has smoothed him out.

The knee is a scary injury and never to be taken lightly, but that’s why they shut him down for the season, even as the Lakers were rolling to the Finals. They realize how good he can be and how important he is to the future and they weren’t going to risk anything with his knee. Clearly, a long term decision over a short-term one. Bynum will be 100% by October.

Yeah, everyone’s talking about moving Odom. You kind of fell bad for him in a way because he has been the subject of trade rumors every year since he got here. But when you consider Odom is making 14.5 mil a year now, how much will he make when he gets a new contract after next season? And how would the Lakers ever be able to afford him while paying Kobe’s and Pau’s salaries and having to give Bynum a new contract this year or next, along with having Sasha and Turiaf up for new contracts now. That’s a lot of payroll. Why not get something for Odom now before he walks as a free agent?

Sent: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 1:41 pm
Subject: Re: [Paul Oberjuerge] Comment: “Lakers Future: Should They Trade Lamar?”

It’s too bad Walton ain’t worth a crap. If he was a competent 3, who can stretch defenses, we wouldn’t be talking about this.

And that’s the thing about Marion … he’s got to be a threat to make a 3.

And I suppose he is. Just looked it up. He’s 34.1 percent from three in his career, 33 percent last season. He just needs to be wide-ass open, since he shoots the ball from his chest.

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 1:56 PM, wrote:

Yeah, Marion can shoot when he is open, and Kobe, Pau and Bynum should be able to pass and create shots for him. But Marion is great running in the open court.

The only thing I’d worry about with Marion is his psyche and whether Phil can make him mature.

Sent: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 2:17 pm
Subject: Re: [Paul Oberjuerge] Comment: “Lakers Future: Should They Trade Lamar?”

Well, that’s what Phil gets $10 million a year for.

The “running” part is kinda useless when it really matters — in the latter rounds of the playoffs. Where there IS no running.

And here’s a big problem: Marion has a player-option for one more year at $17 million. The Lakers won’t want to take on that salary, I don’t think. Plus then they’d have to re-sign him, and he’s probably gotten used to being overpaid.

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 3:56 PM, wrote:
Your points are true and true. That’s why it would have to be a sign-and-trade for Marion, something like that. But then that still would be a high salary to pay, so who knows. Maybe find a 3 who already is signed to a long-term deal that is relatively cheap compared to what it would cost to lock one down now, in a year, or 2.

Another trade thought I had — I was thinking the Bulls have a lot of spare parts that maybe there is some deal that can be made there involving any one of Odom, Walton, Vlad Rad for the likes of Kirk Hinrich, Luol Deng, Ben Gordon, Andres Nocioni. All these guys are good, quality players that are not All-Star level players but fill a role and a need for the Lakers. I don’t think the Lakers need another All-Star becuase they already have the best offensive option on the planet and two other ones in the starting lineup in Pau and Bynum. I don’t think the Bulls would trade Deng for Odom. Gordon and Nocioni both come off the bench, so how valuable can the Bulls really deem them to be, and Hinrich will become expendable after they draft Derrick Rose with the first pick in the draft next week. Farmar may raise his game to the point where he is starting next season over Fisher at some point but Farmar is small and Phil likes his big guards, and Hinrich is the prototypical PG type who is 6-4 or 6-5.

All that said, what the Lakers really need is a veteran 3 who can guard 3s and rebound, and have a mental toughess about them when the game gets physical and when the game gets into crunch time.

Speaking of Phil, another point I meant to make is that while I don’t necessarily think Phil got outcoached in the Finals, because Boston simply had the Lakers outmanned with its big 3 and veteran guys performing off the bench like PJ, Posey and House, it seems like Phil has gotten too mellow in his age now where he doesn’t seem to be the influence on a game or on his players that he once was. I don’t have any way of quantifying it, but it’s just a feeling I’ve had. Maybe it’s not Phil. Maybe it’s just the overwhelming amount of youth on the roster that can’t be taught hoops IQ and how to respond to adversity until they experience down times.

Whatever anyone wants to say about the Lakers, they made the Finals without Bynum and Ariza, who should be starting next year, which is a huge jump from last year. I know the innate impatience of Lakers fan yearns to cry foul about the team and what needs to be done, but this is the 2nd youngest team in the NBA whose future is in front of them. With Kobe’s determination and the shape he keeps himself in, he can be remain an elite player and an all-star into his mid-30s. While he may lose quickness, he will continue to gain basketball smarts, saavy and more polish on his skills and footwork that will offset the physical reductions.

I know it’s hard to exercise patience because the Lakers were right there and there are no guarantees of going back to the Finals, but this team has more Finals appearances in them in the next 6-7 years.