Back in August, we first had this discussion, in The National newsroom.

“Manchester United, ordinary team.”

I said, “Every great sports franchise has down periods. Interludes. And it could happen to Manchester United. Like, this season.”

My colleague, a United fan, said: “Not possible. Too much revenue. They can buy any player they want.”

And now?

The colleague has gone quiet. And I am trying not to be smug.

It could be something as simple as age. You’re around a few years, you see all the great teams, the dynasties, fade out. The New York Yankees. The Dallas Cowboys. UCLA basketball. Sometimes they come back. But they always have rough patches.

Why should Manchester United be immune?

To be sure, in this guy’s adult lifetime, Manchester United never had a bad season. In 21 seasons, they won 13 championships in England’s top flight, and never finished lower than third.

But all that was under the same coach, Alex Ferguson. And this season always had potential for trouble because the old coach retired.

(Look back at “dynasties past”. A fault line often shows itself when the old coach steps down. Vince Lombardi‘s Packers. Wooden‘s Bruins. Phil Jackson‘s Lakers.)

Now Ferguson has retired, and he choose his successor as coach, David Moyes, a fellow Scot, who made his reputation by being everything Ferguson was not. In 11 seasons at Everton, Moyes took modest talent and wrung out just about everything they had to give, and tended to finish somewhere in the seven-to-10th range in the league. Which is good. For Everton.

But, significantly, Moyes never won a trophy, at Everton. Not even a league cup.

So, now …

Today, Manchester United was thrashed by the ancient enemy, Liverpool, in the pompously named “Theatre of Dreams” — or Old Trafford, as the United stadium is known to the rest of us.

It was Liverpool 3, United 0, and the former is a lot closer to its 19th England championship than United is to its 21st.

(The darkest of all possible United dreams … Liverpool winning the title, and then sitting only one behind them in the “most championships” thing, a stat Liverpool once owned, but was slowly and successfully battered down by Ferguson’s United, much to they-thought-their-eternal delight.)

So, this season? United has nine defeats in 29 matches and is seventh in the table. The club is out of the FA Cup and got nowhere near the league cup. And, this week, unless it overturns a 2-0 deficit to Olympiakos (for goodness sake), it will go out in the Uefa Champions League final 16.

The club is nearly certain not to play in the Champions League next year, and faces a major overhaul. The club needs to decide if it wants to stick with Moyes, and let him lead the makeover. Or go back to the coaching pool for another candidate to replace Moyes.

I will give United fans this: They have remained loyal, on the whole. They remember (or were told) about how Ferguson struggled for several seasons before he became a serial winner.

But every great team can fall. Never forget that. Never try to deny it.